Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 14:02:01 GMT From: "KeithG" <noonenopsaml.com> Subject: Re: New Saab, old story.
Well, that is your opinion. I have experienced both and, a properly operating ABS system will allow much more control in any emergency maneuver. It is a learned behavior to operate ABS correctly, but then again, so is driving. Since I drive cars with properly operating, well designed, systems I am very happy with them. Many people have developed their opinions of ABS after the GM fiasco and concluded, wrongly, that it did not work. In reality, it was that particular system which was not designed to work correctly, but designed just enough to put it on the list of optional features. I, too, drive a 5 speed do not like an automatic. I do feel that ABS is a driver aid that I will want to keep, though, because it allows some control in a generally uncontrolled situation. The reason that ABS is outlawed in most all racing series is that it affords consistently shorter stopping distances. The governing bodies want to maintain some level of driver control in the series and this would blur the distinction between the drivers' abilities. I have not driven the S80, but a properly designed ABS system will not intervene unless the driver is at the limits of the tire's adhesion (hence a locked wheel). I would assume that Volvo has it figured out by now, but cannot comment further. I would probably sum it up that you feel about ABS like I feel about traction control. I just hope that you are able to perform a proper evaluation sometime to see what it is really capable of. In the driver school, I was able to stop the Accord within 10 feet of the ABS distance after a bit of practice over the same course. This is still a lot. My first pumping try was over 30 ft longer from 70mph. The problem is that reality does not usually allow for practice and every emergency situation is different. Regards, KeithG "Nutmegger" <nutmeggernopsameja.com> wrote in message news:3e7970be.0106270302.39248b0enopsaming.google.com... > Repost > > Title: Re: New Saab, old story. > Author: Nutmegger<Menopsamcretroad.com> > Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2001 22:20:34 GMT > > > > > In article <YYHZ6.64416$V5.8376042nopsamoon.columbus.rr.com>, KeithG says... > > > >Please do not continue to spread disinformation about ABS. > > Are you addressing this to me? I'm not spreading disinformation, just stating > my opinion. > > >ABS works, period. > > Well........ > Here is my opinion FWIW. I feel like ABS is a sort of "dumbing down" of the > driver, like s/he couldn't be able to handle braking correctly in the first > place so the car takes over for you. I don't like it, same reason I don't like > automatics. > > >If it was not an advantage, why is it outlawed in just about every > >racing series? > > I'm sure there is a reason other than what you are implying. > > >It is worth the money it costs and it is worth the money it > >costs to fix it. > > Not in my opinion. If it were an option on a vehicle, I'd skip it. > > >It has saved my car a few times and it has saved my dad's > >life. > > That's great, sincerely. The Saab 900 I had saved mine, good tires too. > > >What is not worth it is the junky Kelsey Hayes 1 channel ABS on most > >older GM trucks (says ABS on the tailgate). Also a number of early systems > >which were copies of the Bosch did not work well at all, requiring a lot of > >pedal effort and DID increase stopping distances (i.e. early GM systems). > > I've driven a brand new Volvo S80 with ABS, I did not like it - it bothered me > and did not impress me. > > >I > >recently did a defensive driving course and under controlled situations, I > >was able to almost get the same braking distance without ABS as with, but > >with much more concentration (Honda Accord). It took quite a bit of practice > >to achieve this and I would not trust myself to perform in this manner on > >the road. As for straight tracking of your '86 Saab, the stopping distance > >was with locked tires which is no where as short as with ABS or pumping the > >pedal. > > How did you know it was an '86 when I didn't specify? > I fully believe if I had ABS, I still would've hit her, maybe not at the same > speed, but...... > And, I did manage to pump a few times, before I locked them up. > > >No argument will suffice to prove otherwise. Simple physics. > > I believe you, but it all doesn't change my mind about ABS. > I classify it as I do drivers air bags in the steering wheel. They are designed > for the 'general' public and can do much good. Without getting into all of it, > we all know the flip side of them. Being small - it would probably do damamge > to me and also I've seen many accidents with them where they actually were a > hinderance to the driver trying to control the vehicle. > > > >Regards, > > > >KeithG > >"Nutmegger" <Menopsamcretroad.com> wrote in message > >news:d2yZ6.625$eu4.1376nopsamnewsranger.com... > >> In article <3B2D6C9B.2E5C20B2nopsamcom>, Four Weis says... > >> > > >> >ABS extends braking distance, but it allows you to steer while braking. > >> > >> It does?! > >> > >> >My Saab without ABS stops in a shorter distance than my my Saab with ABS. > >On wet and icy > >> >roads the ABS has the advantage. > >> > >> I didn't like ABS when I drove a C70 that had it. > >> Also, I was going about 50mph when I had to slam on the brakes in my 86 > >900S and > >> although I didn't stop in time, I stopped fast on wet pavement and the ass > >end > >> didn't kick around. That car held the road, although I did lay down half > >my > >> tires. I really was surprised at how well the car controlled while > >breaking > >> that quick. Better than my neck, that's for sure. > >> > >> > >> >The non-ABS car with better tires will stop faster and with better > >> >control than an ABS car with average tires. I ran Pirelli P600s and > >Winter >190s and had no problems in the snow and ice - without ABS. > >> > >> HEY! Those are the tires I had! I just love Pirellis the best. I > >*really* > >> feel a difference in the ride and handling with them. > >> > >> ~J~ > > > > > > ~J~
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