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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:02:53 GMT
From: "Dexter J" <>
Subject: Re: Why is this newsgroup all technical troubleshooting?

Salutations: On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 02:51:00 GMT, Saab Guy <> wrote: > Dexter J, > > That was very well said. > > I am curious, when was the first sign in your opinion when the "writing > was on the wall" so to speak? Also, did many from Saab move to Volvo and > when did that transition start? I really don't know the details - but I think most of the serious engineering folks would have started preparing resumes about the time GM started making noise about the remaining shares. As to moving to Volvo, again I don't know - but there seem to be a real set of design and engineering improvements by the mid/late 90's starting with the 940/60 series (964 in particular) right into the S turbo sedans. It's amazing how much they look and feel like first and second generation 9000's. Not exactly the same being RWD and 6 bangers - but put two of them together on the parking lot and walk around - they almost appear to have come from the same mind. Take one for a spin and they ride remarkably alike. And much more nibble than their 850 Volvo predecessors. Don't like the current generation though - I don't know why exactly, but they just don't peak my interest at all. Not as sharp drivers either based on a short test I took one out on. > > This "Brand Exploitation" is so true nowadays, saddens me to pieces. > It's all over the place "Dell, The North Face, Nabisco". Again - just exactly how much sawdust can you put in the burger before the yokels catch on? > > I don't think that Panasonic has fallen victim to this yet. Do you think > that Volvo hasn't either? I don't know on Panasonic or Volvo - I've ended up buying Sony and SAAB and so far they hold up pretty well. But - my current inventory are from the 90's (later for the Sony - earlier for the SAAB), so I'm not sure I'm qualified to say. When the current 1993 Aero becomes truly inoperable to the point of no recovery - which I hope will be some years from now as the body is in pretty good shape as of today - I will probably then be looking at an A series Audi, late 90's early 2000's Volvo or just another mid/late 90's 9000 from some southern area of North America - as I will be able to move what mechanical parts I have uprated on my current machine over to it. Where I live, the primary challenge is keeping the body, chassis and electrical operational given winter conditions and remedies. Fuel is starting to become a popular issue - but again - I'm making *very* reasonable mileage with good available power for the total amount of cubic space I'm driving down the road in the 9000. > > Saab Guy > -- Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day Johnny Favourite - Country Club all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads no news no phone in no sign up required - all the Time > > On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 02:25:07 GMT > "Dexter J" <> wrote: > >> On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 18:48:24 -0400, ma_twain <> wrote: >> >> > To quote the GM execs "No one cares what is in the car, all they want >> > is the Saab name". >> >> Hey brother Twain - long time no hear. I think that about sums up the >> problem and perhaps the solution. >> >> SAAB in many ways reflects the current supply side trending towards the >> lowest minimum possible acceptable level of quality, endurance and >> service >> in Branded products. Just exactly how much sawdust can you put in the >> burger before they yokels catch on I suppose? >> >> I think I heard another CEO at the Nabisco group explaining it as >> "harvesting the Brand value to the shareholders".. Which I guess >> explains >> why my Ritz crackers now sux. >> >> Essentially, GM is losing money because they are making bad cars under >> good badges right now. "Not meeting expectations at a consumer level" to >> sensitize the statement into a more corporately and socially acceptable >> non-phrase. >> >> I was saddened to figure out why my 1993 Aero has been springing >> erroneous >> CEL alerts that seemed impossible to diagnose. A simple 5 cent part - >> that >> really deserved to be a 10 cent part considering it's impact on the >> greater engineered package. Hello 50% GM ownership at the time. >> >> What makes the whole situation all the more frustrating is that GM >> really >> have the right answer in the Epsilon initiative, but I don't think they >> can get there MBA mortarboards around it. One chassis - sliding scale >> for >> *everything* from the headlights, to the engine, to the suspension, to >> the >> body and *everything* inside of it. >> >> Build a wider lower 9000 on it and make it 4 wheel drive a Turbo >> Diesel.. >> You beat the pants off the Magnum on all counts. End game - roll out the >> grass and sweep up the stands. >> >> Formalize the wiring harness and relays to a *much* better specification >> and open source the engine management CPU. Didn't they brain the Mars >> Rovers with UNIX? >> >> And why in the world the LPT hasn't been properly exploited into the >> general manufacturing of pretty much all gasoline based GM products is >> really beyond me - unless of course it's cheaper to build a V6 - or - >> engineering can't get it through marketing without the pitch droids >> insisting on trying to make a huge and undeliverable expectation out of >> it. >> >> You know, I looked long and hard at the decision to buy a 1993 9000 >> over a >> 2004 ^95 - both Aero. >> >> At the end of the day, I really do get much better value and have a >> overall better build car for about 10% of the reduced year end list on >> the >> ^95. Moreover, I don't have to carry all the heavy insurance to please >> the >> money changers. >> >> I effectively turn my monthly payment into an uprate or a repair over >> the >> next 5-10 years, keep the body rust proofed and give it a fresh sanding >> and paint every so often.. Why, there is every likelihood I will get *a >> lot* of happy years out of her. >> >> That 'uprate' isn't going to be Koni's or Maptune - it is going to be >> electrical, plastics and rubber parts.But once done, I have a >> *remarkably* >> fuel efficient car with *huge* interior capacity and some measure of >> real >> style and comfort that I think looks pretty good against anything on the >> GM showroom floor today. Wax her up, slip on a set of Euro blinkers and >> lights and take her to a Cadillac lot - I can assure you it will get as >> many inquiries as the STS sitting beside it. >> >> Metal, plastic and rubber is just that - it knows no nationality - nor >> does the commitment to trying to engineer something that is *actually* >> as >> good as and better than the previous model lineup. It was in many ways >> what made SAAB great. They functioned in a culture of incremental >> improvement from the 96 and 99 forward on a agreed platform right >> through >> the C900 series and, I would argue, the 9000 up to 1995/6. Was it the >> most >> advanced engine or design throughout their model runs? .. Nooohoho .. >> Was >> an actually better SAAB available when it came time to trade it through >> those years - yes. >> >> At the end of the day, I fear the mantra of 'Shareholder Value' in >> conjunction with 'Brand Exploitation' has done great harm over the last >> 10 >> or so years to a lot of great products including automobiles. >> Individually >> and in balance with "Product and Service Improvement" they work great - >> but ignoring the latter two in favour of the first two as a leading >> policy >> at the executive level... Well - you end up losing 1.2 billion on the >> biggest incorporated production and finance enterprise ever developed... >> >> There - you have something other than a trouble shooting note. I've been >> chastised in the past for posting crap like this - but what the hell, >> that's what I have to say about it. Personally, I think most of the real >> SAAB talent headed over to Volvo when the writing was on the wall. >> >> Hey brother grunff - how is the BMW trist holding up? Still wine and >> roses? >> >> --

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