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Posted by Drew in Houston [Email] (more from Drew in Houston) on Wed, 23 Nov 2005 09:55:22 Share Post by Email
In Reply to: Id rather go with what makes results, jak [Profile/Gallery] , Wed, 23 Nov 2005 05:34:51
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So like I said, there has literally been volumes of research done on the subject that concludes exactly what I posted in the first post.

I'm not quoting my own theories or untested laboratory research from inside a bubble, I'm referring to well documented and publicized research and field work done by many many knowledgeable people---all with the exact same goals of making real consistent power in the real world. A few minutes with Google shows a lot of people have spent a lot of time on this exact topic, both empirically and anecdotally, and that there is general agreement in the findings. I can loan you my SAE membership number too if you want to download some papers at a discount.

Also like I said before, there are reasons for running richer than necessary and some of them are valid... But, if you want to make a blanket statement and cite a 1.8 VW turbo as an example of why to run 11:1 because-of control reasons (not chemical/mechanical) and apply it to T-7, than you also have to assume that at minimum, the control and sensing schemes are the same between Saab and VW--and of course they're not.

Research as well as real-world results show where max power is made and it's not in the 11's:1 area for gas SI engines.

That said, it doesn't surprise me one bit that Frieling saw a 30 hp increase by dropping to 11:1 compared to 13:1--but it's guaranteed that there is more information involved with that statement than you're conveying.

Regardless, neither of us have a phd after our names. Speaking for myself, that means I know that I'm not qualified to have a valid opinion outside-of the overwhelming amount of published research information and wouldn't presume to tell others information, presented as a fact, based-upon a few phone conversations or emails.

As for safety margin there is some unknowns with this specific application. However, I can tell you that I've been driving a T-7 with a wideband meter full-time everyday w/stock software and flow mods and what I've seen from the control indicates to me that it is more than capable of maintaining acceptable control--of course this area of the world has fairly consistant altitudes and temperatures, so take that statement for what it's worth. But now that I think about it, you rode in my car in a very similar state in your part of the world too.

BTW, we both know that "cracking T-8" or any other engine management is way different than actually doing real research on something like, say, flame front propagation. "Cracking" any engine management is embedded electrical work--nothing to do with power. Extracting power is a mixture of mechanical and chemical know-how.










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