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Here's the general scoop.... Posted by Saabpilot [Email]  (#134) [Profile/Gallery]
(more from Saabpilot) on Wed, 17 Dec 2008 20:26:25
In Reply to: Re: Once again, I'm a VP of a generator company!, swede-murphy   [Profile/Gallery]
, Mon, 15 Dec 2008 20:21:05
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Again, just so everyone knows, my company only sells in Ohio, so I have no personal vested financial interest in providing brand or product advice to anyone in New England....
Without a doubt, the best possible scenario is a permanent, hard-installed generator and automatic transfer switch. Of course, we all live in the world of reality and not everyone is in a position to afford that. For a *typical* residential generator in the 10 - 13kW range, you can expect to pay around $7,000 to $9,000 for the equipment and proper installation by a licensed electrical contractor and plumber. That is an Ohio number, and prevailing labor rates and the complexity or simplicity of your installation in your location may vary.
There are two types of residential automatic transfer switches: 1) The type that energizes a "sub-panel." A sub-panel is a slave to your circuit breaker panel, into which you move your critical circuits, critical as defined by you. Most people put their heating system there, as well as anything life safety related (if you are on an oxygen concentrator for example), as well as cooking, water heater, etc. It very well may take electrician diagnostic and re-wiring time to do this, depending on how your home is presently wired.
2) An integrated load center. Various manufacturers call this product various names, but essentially it replaces your existing circuit breaker panel with a panel that contains an integrated automatic transfer switch. If you're building a new home and want to install a generator, or pre-plan for one later, this is the only smart way to go. Typically these are available in 200 amp sizes only. If you live in a very large house or have electrical backup needs in excess of 200 amps, you are looking at a different class of product completely. What seperates these integrated load center / transfer switches from a regular transfer switch is they are "service entrance rated." It is illegal and unsafe to use a non-service entrance rated transfer switch as the first device your incoming electrical service connects to. These devices combine the circuit breaker panel with the transfer switch and make for a very clean installation, and make it easy for you to pre-plan for which circuits you want backed up by your generator.
Many / most homeowners start out saying they want to back up their entire house, but when they see the installed cost of that size generator, they back off quickly. A 20 kW will back up the entire house in a typically sized suburban home.
Why is a permanently installed generator the best way to go? Because you don't have to worry about a thing providing it's connected to a reliable fuel supply and installed properly. It works whether you are home or away.
For permanently installed generators there are three types of fuel. Diesel (not common in residential applications), natural gas or LP. Advantages / disadvantages?
Diesel: Advantages - for residential, none. Unless you are a fuel dealer. In many States, EPA operation permits and usage logs are required. Disadvantages - you must keep the tank full. In the event of a major power outage or crisis such as a hurricane or tornado, you will NOT be first on the list for fueling companies...in fact you as Joe Homeowner will be at the bottom of the list. Public safety agencies will, and should be on the top of the list. Diesel fuel is subject to water and bacteria, and must be tested and treated regularly if it is not consumed in a timely manner.
Natural gas: Advantages - if connected properly, it is always available. If your gas lines have come apart, you have much bigger problems to worry about because you've probably experienced an earthquake! However, you must confirm your local gas company can deliver the pressure and volume required by your generator. If you don't do this before you buy a generator, you are foolish. Don't assume just because you have natural gas appliances that your gas system will carry the load of your generator. It takes much more pressure and volume, depending on generator engine size than it takes to run your water heater or stove. If you happen to live in a low pressure area (there are low pressure, intermediate pressure and high pressure gas areas, as defined by the gas companies), and if you are at or near the "end of the line," your pressure could be insufficient. Disadvantages - none, in a residential application, unless you can't use gas because of insufficient pressure and volume.
LP (liquid propane): Advantages - readily available if you have a propane company that regularly checks and fills your tank. Can be installed in areas where natural gas is not available. Disadvantages - you must have a large enough tank to generate enough vapor pressure, even in cold months, to run the generator. Pressure decreases as temperature decreases. However, in small residential generators this is not as much of an issue as in large industrial sets (which is the core of my company's business).
Portable generators and manual transfer switches, or ways to "backfeed" your house without a transfer switch....
Portable generators are certainly fine, although unless you really don't have any money, you should shy away from el-cheapo models you find in closeout catalogs and deep discount stores. You are getting what you pay for, just remember that. We sell a brand of portable that is truly industiral and contractor grade. They're expensive as heck as far as portables go, but they have alot of protection circuitry built into them, and have heavy duty alternators. But, don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with a portable. The obvious issue is do you really know what you are doing connecting this to your house? If you don't know the difference between a volt and a watt and an amp, and those funny little circular plugs look like Greek to you, either have a transfer switch professionally installed that you can connect your portable to, or don't do it at all! Obvious issues with portables are these: fuel type and size of tank. If the generator runs on gasoline, you will have to manually check the tank and refill it. It WILL run out of gas at the most inconvenient time (Murphy's Law). You must determine whether you are going to use a transfer switch, backfeed your house (more later on this), or simply run extension cords to a few key appliances during a power outage, such as your refrigerator, electric stove, a few lights, etc. You also have to consider whether you have enough room to store the generator, and to run it. DO NOT RUN IT IN YOUR GARAGE OR BASEMENT. Unless killing your family is on your list of things to do. Would you run your SAAB in your garage for 12 hours straight? Of course not. Have room outside your home to safely run the generator or don't do it. Another consideration, if your generator does not have handles and wheels, is can you lift it? During a recent windstorm as a result of Hurricane Ike here in Ohio, I "borrowed" a 5500 watt industrial grade portable generator from my company. Yes, I know, I'm the VP of Sales and I don't have a permanent generator at my house...long story. At any rate, that portable was 183 pounds BEFORE I put gasoline in it. It was a two person lift.
Disclaimer on what you are about to read: as a professional involved in selling, installing and servicing generators I do not recommend this. As a homeowner, ham radio guy, general electronics guy and a tinkerer, would I do this? "No comment." You can, in a pinch, wire your generator to your dryer plug and backfeed your entire house with generator power, providing you TURN OFF your main circuit breaker first. If you don't turn off that breaker and power comes back on, you may have a fire or explosion, and you may lose your house. If you don't know anything about electricity or wiring, DON'T DO THIS. It's not worth losing your house.
All of the above applies to residential situations. Commercial and industrial generator backup systems are a totally different animal in terms of their potential complexity as well as, local, State and National codes involved, etc. Life safety applications are a different animal as well.
If anyone wants advice or opinion on your own particular situation, feel free to email me directly. It's always great to help out another Saab person, no matter what the subject.
, Sat, 13 Dec 2008 23:42:59, Sun, 14 Dec 2008 18:31:52, Thu, 18 Dec 2008 22:34:28, Wed, 17 Dec 2008 19:48:20, Mon, 15 Dec 2008 20:21:05, Wed, 17 Dec 2008 20:26:25 <-- Viewing This Message, Mon, 15 Dec 2008 14:56:14
, Sun, 14 Dec 2008 21:44:40
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