1999-2009 [Subscribe to Daily Digest] |
This is something I've wondered a bit about... there may be conflicting data here. I agree, side impacts are the most difficult collisions for which to design a car... One of the main reasons we just bought a 9-5 was for the superior side impact design. Anyway, here's some data points + feel free to comment/refute...
- first off (you probably realize this but the original poster may not), the 9-5 doesn't have side curtains, but doesn't seem to need them per se (with the pendulum B pillar - SAAB was the one who pointed out the need for SUV side impact testing + capability, back in the 1990s with the 9000 T-boned by Landrovers). Most other cars need side curtains to get good results in SUV side impact testing. I'm not sure the impact of 3 seats with a side curtain (if any?)...
- a recent sad story here: minivan (recent Honda Odyssey, but no curtain airbag) was T-boned by a Volvo sedan (I think 850). sliding door caved in + a child (properly seated in a car seat) was crushed + didn't survive. Speed at impact couldn't have been much more than 30mph - the Volvo was cut off while merging from a right turning lane, crossed the yellow line + hit the stationary minivan side on (minivan was waiting at a red light)... speed limit there is roughly 40 mph... very sad. Minivan certainly was not helpful in this case (not even a SUV impact). Volvo had hit another car prior, so would have lost some momentum. Can't imagine the speed at impact was very high. Doesn't take much though!
- swedemurphy had a very pointed post + photo about 2 years ago wrt the 3rd row in most minivans/suvs: "never put *anything* you care about in a 3rd row of anything!!" His wife was rear ended in their (Ford) minivan + anyone in the 3rd row would have been killed. Having driven things like a Mazda 5, I can totally see what he's saying. Those smaller ones in particular have zero margin for a rear end collision. A long wheelbase minivan would be better though I would think (the ones that will take a 4x8 sheet of plywood). A huge SUV where everyone is high up (in a vehicle with lots of mass!) may also fare better. Big SUVs and minivans tend to have fairly low hdli scores... passive safety usually isn't bad, but active safety in them is pretty poor imho (and having driven a GMC Acadia, as a cyclist, I now realize drivers of those things can't see me at all + I should fear for my life in their presence!)...
wrt to the car seat positioning... it probably depends a lot on car seat models, but... With the SK Radian (see my post below) and only 2 of them in the car, there is easily 8" between the edge of the seat + the door. The car would have to collapse inward by that much at torso level before the seat was touched. That's a pretty big hit in a 9-5 (especially the new one!)... with 3 seats, they would be clustered + touching edge to edge, possibly with up to an inch less margin between the seat + door... Tim is this what you are saying: with the middle one restricting the motion of the outer 2, that might be an issue in a very serious collision? the physics is there I suppose (vs captains seats in a minivan with air between them for the seats to bend into)... but the minivan sure didn't fare well in that collision here... car seats are supposed to be very rigidly fastened (ie should be very little motion even with 2 and a gap between), but of course at a high enough impact, nothing is truly rigid... I suppose all 3 adjacent seats could move in tandem (assuming rigid like SK vs some boosters), or the whole Saab rear seat assy also could be shifted... though it's bolted to a very stiff part of the floor pan iirc...
lets face it, the best thing is to avoid a collision in the first place (that's why I place a good bit of emphasis on active safety, as does Saab)... but it may be non-trivial to determine the best compromise in risk avoidance? obviously with 1, putting the seat in the middle is best. with 2, we went with passenger side (older kid), baby in the middle, room for a 3rd adult on drivers side. Now with both forward facing, they get the 2 side positions with a gap between (for sanity + ski pass through). We've had 3 in there too...
I suspect most opt for a minivan primarily for convenience. buckling in the middle child with 3 across is a pain, but not the end of the world, and of course 3 larger kids might appreciate a little more room... still, I'd rather deal with those drawbacks than drive a minivan ;-)... and fortunately for me, so would my wife!!
interesting discussion...
James...
posted by 69.63.51...
, Sun, 1 May 2011 16:09:58
, Wed, 27 Apr 2011 05:44:50
No Site Registration is Required to Post - Site Membership is optional (Member Features List), but helps to keep the site online
for all Saabers. If the site helps you, please consider helping the site by becoming a member.
 |
 |
 |
 |
 |
